THE GONCALO AMARAL LIBEL TRIAL

It has been a struggle to get the tribunal Reports onto the forum but it has been very worthwhile because in the final analysis a near word for word record of what was said combined with other Court happenings affords the reader an great opportunity to make up their own mind about the testimony.

This is especially valid since the events at the Palace of Justice are taking part in both English and Portuguese. I have just reviewed the numbers and one Report alone, that relating to Mrs Susan Hubbard, has been downloaded 890 times.

John:

I think it might also be worth pointing out that it is the English language that is being edited and not the actual meaning of the content.

Anne's notes.  

John
Senior Editor
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Posts: 5384
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Justice 4 John Lamberton

Re: We want to thank Anne for attending the libel hearings.
« Reply #22 on: Today at 05:40:19 PM »

Quote from: gilet on Today at 05:30:18 PM
I presume you mean by QED, "Quo errat demonstrator"!

Because there is no logical proof that Anne's report is error free by reference to the fact that there happens to be a law which prohibits misrepresenting witnesses.

It may well be her intent to remain error free but the existence of the law and even the attempt to adhere to the law does not prove her reports have achieved that goal.

Without the full record of the writing of the reports we can not be sure how much was reliance on memory or notes and cannot be sure how much influence the editor had on the final document.

In the interest of full truth there would appear to be very good reason for allowing us to see all the documentation.

What would be the reason for refusal?

Because you couldn't interpret them even if you wanted to

Lyall
Full Member

Re: We want to thank Anne for attending the libel hearings.
« Reply #25 on: Today at 05:50:46 PM »

Quote from: davel on Today at 05:46:08 PM
There is no problem, those who wish to take Annes reports as 100% accurate are free to do so...and those who think their may be errors are also free to do so

Who is claiming they are 100% accurate? Who claims a report by a journalist is?

Historians will tell us there's no such thing as 100%.

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Online AnneGuedes
Executive Member
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Posts: 3561

Re: Why didn't the McCanns ask that the case not be shelved?

« Reply #22 on: Today at 07:58:35 PM »
Quote from: TTSOFAFM on Today at 05:48:23 PM

Remember Kate McCann had a copy of all the files, including the reports of British children that were molested in the Algarve and those reports relating to the attempted molestations.

There are no such files on the DVD and the deputy AG Melchior Gomes made clear that the files concerning sex offenders weren't included.

Post by Lyall
Thank you. A few. So how can a few be the cause of harassment or persecution?

UK Justice Forum ‏@Justice_forum 21 Sep
Exclusive to UK Justice Forum. Follow the #McCann v Gonçalo #Amaral libel hearings in detail with our pdf Reports > http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?board=68.0 …

verity ‏@Verity_2012 4m
@Justice_forum are these actual professional court reports or just someone telling you they have made their own reports? #mccann

verity ‏@Verity_2012 4m
@Justice_forum how did you get a deal with the portuguese court to give you exclusivity to court reports? #mccann

verity ‏@Verity_2012 3m
@Ans4MBM @Justice_forum from what I can see they are not actual court reports just someone claiming they are with no verification #mccann

Lizzy Hideho Taylor
MESSAGES OF SUPPORT FOR GONCALO AMARAL (Will be delivered to him personally)

Gonçalo Amaral's day in court tomorrow. We all wish him well and look forward to hearing his side of the story. IT SHOULD BE INTERESTING!

I will compile all messages and ensure that he PERSONALLY receives them within the next week.

Please remember there is a fund to assist his court expenses..

gilet

Re: Is the realease of police files a good thing?
« Reply #61 on: Today at 11:23:15 PM

Quote from: Luz on Today at 11:18:52 PM
No personal information was released, it wasn't even approved to be investigated, unfortunately.


That is possibly the most ridiculous comment you or any other anti-McCann has ever posted on this forum.

Thousands of personal details were released on DVD including personal phone numbers, places of work, ages, dates of birth, passport numbers, photographs, addresses (relating to children and adults alike).

I can think of no reason other than an attempt to hide the truth that you would post such absolute nonsense.

will the real Anne Guedes stand up

Mike Spudgun ‏@spudgun01 21 Feb
The #McCanns must be the first 'former suspects' in History to successfully SILENCE anyone who believes them to be complicit in any crime.


anne guedes
‏@aacg
@spudgun01 Their success is due to the many personalities who supported blindly their absurd theory.

Joana Morais @ xklamation 22 Feb
Petition to pressure PT Authorities reopen the Maddie case to http://www. change.org / petitions / a-vo ice-for-madeleine ... # J4M

anne guedes @ AACG 22 Feb
@ xklamation They never will, Joana, Unless they'd find a corpse, not 'cause nothing Remained (imo). And remember Pontius Pilate!

anne guedes @ AACG 20 Feb
@ ProfilerPatB May be Between ground and sky as well, if I may say.

Quote from: AnneGuedes on September 26, 2013, 10:46:33 PM

Just for information. Please, Mods, destroy this thread after a few hours.
Here is such a reconstitution in Spain. You'll see that you can't see nothing... The media are maintained in a distance.
A girl supposed to have disappeared was found dead. 12, brilliant, adopted and adored. Both parents in custody.
http://www.lavanguardia.com/sucesos/20130926/54388048104/asunta-basterra-nina-prodigio.html

Gilet:
It is precisely what is now done in the UK with the aid of computer simulation which allows for every possible option to be considered with no time constraints and with no disruption to people or locations.

It is not what UK citizens expect because here we believe in using the public as a potential source of useful information and therefore the aim is to publicise details in order to get public support. A very large number of crimes are solved in this manner.

Libel trial McCann v Gonçalo Amaral - Day 4 Witness No 2
The testimony as it happened...
(20.09.2013, 3:30pm) Maria Isabel Stilwell is a writer and the editor of Destak, the first free daily newspaper in Portugal. She says she interviewed Kate McCann in May 2011 when she launched the Portuguese translation of the book "Madeleine". She only knows Gonçalo Amaral by reputation and has never had any dealings with any of the other defendants. The witness is asked about libel judgements she is or has been part of. She answers that she presently has no process with Gonçalo Amaral.
The Judge asks if the witness has read Gonçalo Amaral's book.
IS says she has.
The Judge asks whether IS has watched his documentary.
IS says "yes".
The Judge asks whether the witness' public controversial position concerning Gonçalo Amaral will influence her testimony.
IS says her conscience tells her "no", but then adds she hopes it will not.
1) The McCann family lawyer, Isabel Duarte, is the first to question the witness.
ID - Are you a writer?
IS says "yes".
ID - Are you familiar with all the files in this case?
IS says she is aware of the contents of the Attorney General’s Final Report and adds that she wrote about it.
ID - What was your job then?
IS says she was the editor of Destak. She adds that the book campaign was massive.
The Judge overrules the comment as off topic for now.
ID - What was the effect of the Amaral book on the public?
IS – Any person who announces he/she will tell people all the truth is very successful.
ID - About the audience share of the documentary, how did you obtain that data?
IS doesn't know but thinks Destak may have found the information online.
ID - It had over 2 million viewers! Is that normal?
IS apologises for being trivial but draws a parallel to a major football competition.
ID - Did the attention of the media and the people diminish after the publication of the book?
IS believes so. She says the issue which had most focus was whether Madeleine was alive or dead. She refers to people in Portugal who believe that bad things happen to bad people and that good things happen to good people. People think that "criminals are always different from us and since the McCanns aren't like us, they are widely considered cold and uncaring."
Dr Santos de Oliveira, lawyer for Gonçalo Amaral listening to this exchange has become increasingly exasperated, reacts saying that it is nothing to do with his client. ID's assistant also reacts vehemently. The judge tells them to stop immediately.
SO dictates the court clerk a protest saying that the witness exhibits a hostile demeanour towards his client and asks that her statement not be admitted by the Court. ID obviously protests.
The Judge cites an Article from Chapter 6, section I of the CPC which can preclude a witness from testifying. She adds that SO presented none of these arguments. Therefore nothing prevents IS from testifying. But the Judge requests that the questions be more objective.
ID - Did the attention of the public and the media decrease after the publication of the book and the broadcast of the documentary?
IS says she "has a feeling" it did.
ID - Are there numbers, notes supporting this?
IS says that as a newspaper editor she knows when an issue is important. She resumes her narrative about beliefs that bad things happen to bad people and observes that everything (in the media) tended to make the McCann couple more distant than they were. When finally the book was published, the issue appeared to be resolved and closed.
ID - The Maddie case has been deeply and amply treated, there have been many other books...
IS interrupts objecting she read none of these books. She thinks they're not of much concern and adds that none of them has the credibility or impact of a book written by an ex-inspector who was initially in charge of the case.
ID asks if she knows that former PJ inspector Moita Flores commented on the Maddie case and the book on TV.
IS knows that the book was commented on TV, on the news. She remembers that MF praised Gonçalo Amaral and she adds that a child can be missing without the parents being guilty. She remembers the title "PJ inspector agrees with homicide". She wrote on the providencia cautelar (the Injunction) because the people imagined that the issue was to examine whether the parents were guilty or not, she wanted to speak on freedom of expression versus the right to a good name.
She resumes her narrative about newspapers which publish anything just for a story, people who accept anything as the truth, etc.
ID asks whether the facts mentioned in the book and the documentary were facts established in the Final Report.
IS thinks they're not, otherwise the parents would have be tried. She says that none of the allegations were proved. She says it is typical Portuguese provincialism to believe the opposite of what a Final Report says.
ID - Were the facts mentioned by Gonçalo Amaral ascertained?
S thinks "no". The Final Report says there is no proof. She adds that it is not legitimate to speak of freedom of expression without limits.
ID - asks whether the witness speaks of a paragraph in the book or of the insinuations in the conclusions.
The Judge overrules, she requires more precision.
ID - says she refers to the paragraph containing the words, “fraud or abuse of trust...” ("burla ou
abuso de...")
During a moment of relaxation at one of these meetings, I did a side step or I might have been inopportune and rather undiplomatic. Worried with the possibility that the McCann couple were somehow involved in their daughter's disappearance and reflecting about the kind of crime they might have committed, something occurred to me. If, really, any type of responsibility of the McCann couple was confirmed, then the fund set up to finance the search for Madeleine that had reached nearly €3 million could be a crime of fraud or abuse of trust. This question was debated and, in fact, with such premises the crimes of qualified fraud or abuse of trust could exist, but Portugal would have no jurisdiction to investigate and judge it. The fund being legally registered in England, it would be our English colleagues who would deal with the case. Our English colleagues then realised a hard reality: the strong possibility that they would have a crime to investigate in their own country, with the McCann couple as the main suspects: a prospect that left them rather reluctant.
IS interrupts and says she didn't read any reference to that fact in the Final Report.
SO objects that this isn't a fact and the Judge concurs.
ID - asks how she can explain the effect of...
IS interrupts and says that whoever reads it sees all the pieces fall into place, the theory seems genuine, it doesn't leave room for doubt. She says it is written from the perspective of a victim.
The Judge again overrules...
IS interrupts saying it's her reading of the book. She adds that if it was true the McCanns would be in jail.
2) Defence lawyers.
a) TVI lawyers’ questions.
TVI - You're not sure about the over 2 millions of audience share?
IS says that at the time she thinks an article was written on this but it's easy to check.
She makes a gesture towards her bag but stops as nobody reacts.
TVI - Are you speaking as a journalist?
S says "yes".
TVI - asks a conclusive question about freedom of expression versus good name.
The Judge again overrules.
IS resumes her narrative criticising the documentary where the group is shown drinking and a little girl left alone without any alternative point of view. How could parents agree with fifty minutes of that? She says that after 33 years of professional work she's allowed to value judgements.
TVI - wants to know if the witness has evidence comparisons on the topic of decreasing interest.
IS says she has.
b) Valentim de Carvalho (DVD production/distribution) lawyer's questions
VC - Do you remember when the Final Report was released?
IS thinks it was in June 2008.
VC reminds her that the Final Report states that the definition of the crime was not established from the available evidence.
IS says she didn't read that.
The Judge intervenes and points out that the case was shelved for lack of evidence.
VC asks whether IS remembers the conclusions of Gonçalo Amaral book and starts to quote an extract...
The results my team and I have arrived at are the following:-
1. The minor, Madeleine McCann died inside apartment 5A of the Ocean Club in Vila da Luz, on the night of 3rd May 2007;
2. There was simulation of abduction;
3. Kate Healy and Gerald McCann are suspects of involvement in the concealment of their daughter's body;
4. The death could have occurred as a result of a tragic accident;
5. There are clues about the parents’ negligence concerning the care and safety of the children.
VC - asks in what way those are facts or conclusions.
IS starts to claim vehemently and loudly that Gonçalo Amaral had no right to, he has an obsession... She mentions the Intermediate Report that he signed (10th September by Tavares de Almeida). She insists that it is worse than the book. She says the book is very well written, easy to read.
VC - Are the facts of the criminal investigation the same as close expressed in the book? If the conclusions...
IS again interrupts, but not to answer. She speaks with a great volubility which renders her speech difficult to understand. She speaks of the newspaper Correio da Manhã and of delirious theories of conspiracy.
c) Guerra & Paz's lawyer's questions
GP - asks since when did IS commence working in journalism.
IS says she started in 1981 and starts listing everything she did in a sarcastic manner.
The Judge intervenes to remind the witness this is a judgement and not to be sarcastic by entering into such minute detail.
GP - was the decrease of news related to the fact it was a book?
IS answers it's obvious that news may emerge when, for example, there's a judgement. The feeling is that people think that what happened is already known.
GP - but...
IS interrupts GP again saying that when there are doubts, people speak a lot. She starts describing how a journalist works.
GP - asks if someone was in charge of marketing of the book.
IS says that marketing actions, to-day, can't be bypassed. She resumes a narrative about the marketing of books, including books for children, cooking, novels, etc.
GP - mentions the three other books written on the case and asks about their marketing.
IS says she didn't read them.
GP – Do you know how many copies the Correio da Manha sells?
IS knows, but asks "what has that got to do with the issue?"
The Judge overrules the witness's question and observes the witness is continuously attempting to give meaning to what she says. IS interrupts the Judge and protests. The Judge concludes she can't help it.
GP – In your editorials you mentioned the position of Gonçalo Amaral...
IS again interrupts saying there are two kinds of things in a newspaper, facts and articles of opinion.
GP – Didn't you say your objective was to clarify things in order to inform the public?
IS answers that from the beginning, in May 2007, she claimed she would be objective and wouldn't necessarily be on the side of the parents, known to be the initial suspects in this kind of case.
GP reminds her that the book was published on the 24th July while the Final Report was released on the 21st July. She wants to know if GA could be aware of the Final Report's conclusions.
The Judge overrules.
d) Santos Oliveira (GA lawyer) questions
SO - Are your opinions only based on news?
IS says "not only". She mentions TV programs, books.
SO - Have you read all the Final Report?
S says "no".
SO – Are you aware that the Final Report indicates the child to be most likely dead?
IS says she is.
SO – Since this hypothesis exists in the Final Report, the book...
IS interrupts again saying the fact of death doesn't mean that the parents are guilty.
The Judge – The Final report doesn't say the homicide is due to the parents.
She reads this part from the Report:
No respeitante aos outros crimes indiciados não passam disso mesmo e pese embora se nos afigurar não ser de descartar, dado o seu elevado grau de probabilidade, a verificação dum homicídio, tal não pode passar de mera suposição por carência de elementos de sustentação nos autos.
Concerning the other indicated crimes, they are no more than that and despite our perception that, due to its high degree of probability, the occurrence of a homicide cannot be discarded, such cannot be more than a mere supposition, due to the lack of sustaining elements in the files.
(Astro translation).
SO - But the book doesn't say that the homicide was due to the parents. If the book doesn't say anything else that what's in the...
IS interrupts, but in turn is immediately interrupted by the Judge.
Judge: Let me do this part!
Evidence ends.
End of day 4.

martinbrunt ‏@skymartinbrunt 8m
#madeleine Today's hearing abandoned because Mr Amaral's lawyer's son is ill.

From Swine Flue To Operations To Another Lawyer Of Amaral's Doing What Really Looks Like The Chicken Dance. Could It Be Because Gerry Is In Town.


Amaral's Trial Postponed Due To Lawyer's Son's Illness

Lizzy Hideho Taylor martinbrunt @skymartinbrunt 6m
#madeleine Today's hearing abandoned because Mr Amaral's lawyer's son is ill.
49 minutes ago

Linda Wrafter Oh fgs

MonBR ‏@Mobyra
Oh, more "health" issues for Amaral's legal team, operations, swine flue, sick children etc. Amaral has such bad luck with lawyers. #McCann

Jerry Lawton ‏@JerryLawton 16m
#mcann libel trial adjourned after Goncalo Amaral's lawyer hurriedly leaves court - Madeleine's dad Gerry flew out for hearing in Lisbon

Piers Morgan ‏@PearsMorganCNN
Amoral's team must be worried Gerry #McCann is testifying. They've faked an illness to get an adjournment!!!

Jerry Lawton ‏@JerryLawton 56s
#mccann libel trial will resume on Wednesday Oct 2 - Madeleine's parents seek £1m from Amaral over his book claims they covered up her death

AnneGuedes

Re: Has anyone else seen this confirmed?
« Reply #30 on: Today at 01:53:42 PM »
The child isn't ill, surgery had to be performed urgently and he needed his dad. Posters should have understood by now that Portuguese don't let down their children.

So, the 'child' isn't ill, but needed urgent surgery. If he's in surgery, what's his father supposed to do - or is he a surgeon as well as a 'police superlawyer'?

And the 'urgent surgery' just happens to be needed the very moment Gerry McCann arrives in Lisbon? Pull the other one, it's got bells on.

And she needn't bother playing the 'perfect Portuguese parents' card, either, or I will feel impelled to post up more sickening stories about familial child abuse in Portugal.

This whole excuse is bogus, everyone knows it, and no amount of spinning from Gonc's mouthpieces is going to change that.

Guedes:

Without a recording device, it is impossible to transcript everything verbatim. The Judge or the lawyers, when they dictate their requests to the court clerk, speak slowly and make pauses. Sometimes I can write down all the words (and use then direct speech), otherwise I use reported speech.
But I wouldn't have transformed "extracts or digest of a book" into "book"

Guedes' version of today's events:

McCann v Gonçalo Amaral Libel Trial in Lisbon - Day 5
« on: Today at 05:25:43 PM »
The Judge appeared at 9:50. All lawyers were there, as well as the interpreter. Dra Isabel Duarte had a new assistant. But in the audience we were only two members of the public (Astro and I), all journalists were outside waiting for Mr McCann and Mrs Cameron. Among the journalists, Martin Brunt was back in Lisbon and back was his very British sense of humour. He is literally chained to his photographer, since he holds the perch ! When the crowd of photographers suddenly rushes in a certain direction, he can't but follow.
Back to court. Mr Amaral's lawyer made a request because his son was in the hospital (it seems the problem surged yesterday) to have a urgent surgery and the father was needed there. Dra Duarte said she made yesterday a request for the complainant G. McCann who is coming from the UK (she insisted twice on this) to be heard. This request has to be accepted by the lawyers of the defence within a few days. The Judge consulted a great amount of books and files when she was dictating to the court clerk. She found Dr Santos Oliveira's request justified and unforeseeable and stated that the adjournment had to be accepted.

The Judge then announced that the 27th witnesses would be heard on the 2nd of October (Henrique Machado (journalist of Correio da Manhã), Eduardo Dâmaso (political analyst) and Mrs Cameron).
From this I deduce that 1) Mrs Healy will not be heard and 2) Mrs Cameron is the last witness for the accusation, except for the bar association president, Marinho Pinto who eventually will be heard on the 19 of November.

The last session (exhibition of the documentary and final allegations) will now be on the 27th of November.
On the 8th of October will be heard only witnesses for the defence :
Inspectores Tavares de Almeida and Ricardo Paiva, Luis Nunes, the head of the Central unit against organized crime, Manuel Catarino, editorialist in the CdM (who seems specialised in juridical issues) and the journalist and writer Hernani Carvalho (who is doing a PhD on criminology)

On the 5th of October will be heard other witnesses for the defence :
Paulo Sargento, Moita Flores, two persons related to Guerra&Paz, etc.
On the 19 of Novempber, will be heard the last witnesses for the defence :
Carlos Coelho da Silva (the documentary film maker), Margarida Teotónio Pereira (TVI director of international programs), etc. and possiby a witness for the accusation (?), José Viega Soares, a consultant in PR who was at the court on day 1 (the only (but me) reading a book and not consulting a smart phone) and was dismissed for that day.
Meanwhile Mr McCann and his sister had arrived. The Judge asked to call the two witnesses first Eduardo Dâmaso and later Trish Cameron. She explained no hearing was possible if a lawyer was missing. She said she was sorry the witnesses would have to come next Wednesday. Mrs Cameron observed it was the second time.. The Judge acknowledged and apologized for this. She said this kind of circumstance, like health, cannot be anticipated and we can't but accept it. She said the court thanked the witnesses.
Mr McCann didn't even enter the audience room.

The Sun guy wasn't there, the one who works for 4 newspapers with 4 different identities to-day was working for 5.
Gonçalo Amaral's car was parked behind the building. So he took another exit. The reporters saw him (I don't know how, they do have hawk eyes) and rushed.

LagosBen
Jr. Member

Re: So seriously -Why was the Trial cancelled today?

Quote from: davel on Today at 07:42:58 PM
perhaps Anne can tell us how old he is

Yes Anne seems "close", so perhaps she will tell us the truth.

LagosBen

Oh Anne seems to have gone  

Bob Evans ‏@BobWillstay1 3h
And the child anti #McCann accused us of being callous towards this morning turns out 2 be a #Adult . In for a planned procedure . #NowtNew